Tonight on Sunday ` trouble in paradise. Should we be worried? Dramatic and unspoiled. It's like living in a painting. It's older than God, I'd say. But developers are circling. WOMAN: Come with us as we take a journey to the heart of Fiordland. A tourist highway through paradise. Are they serious? There is business there. It's just a crazy situation. You're dinky-di Aussie. Burka abuse in Australia. You're in Australia, the lucky country. You're in Australia, the lucky country. Oh, shut up, you idiot. Aussie girls committing to Islam. I will be roasted in hell if I go out with my skin and hair showing. I think he's got a great arse. How old is too old? I sort of feel` still feel I'm burning like white fire inside. Kids at 78,... Most people think I am his daughter if they don't know. ...and a wife 40 years his junior. There will be people who wag the finger and say I shouldn't be having children at my age. How do you answer those sort of people? 'Get stuffed.' Captions were made possible with funding from NZ On Air. Copyright TVNZ Access Services 2012 Kia ora. I'm Miriama Kamo. It's been hailed it as the eighth wonder of the world, and it belongs to you and me. Fiordland's wilderness is pristine, dramatic, beautiful, and it's locked up so you can't touch it, right? Well, now enter the developers. They've floated a couple of pretty bold ideas. One wants to drill an 11km road tunnel into paradise. The other, a monorail through protected beech forest. The vision is to bring up to a million visitors a year into this scenic wonderland. Is this for real? Is there trouble in paradise? Ian Sinclair investigates. OMINOUS MUSIC This is a pretty special corner of NZ. It's like living in a painting. For me, it's about saving this. It's our heritage. SLOW PIANO MUSIC The wilderness of Fiordland ` ancient mountains that have opened a new divide over what to do with them. Because there's a market there, and we're confident that there is business there. SERENE MUSIC It's been hailed as one of the last frontiers in the world. The view of ancient forest and mountains ` priceless. And that, say the locals, is the way it should stay. But developers reckon this view could be spun into millions of tourist dollars. You've gotta adapt or you die in this new world of ours that we live in in relation to tourism and the opportunities that are out there. Because what we're talking about here, we think, is an absolutely first-class tourism initiative, which... John Beattie wants to build a futuristic monorail through this wilderness to ferry thousands of tourists a year to Fiordland's jewel in the crown, Milford Sound. It's unnecessary. It's a crazy thing. It's just nuts. Yeah. Doesn't` Not needed. But it's locals like hunter Lex Lawrence that developers will have to get through first. This is your supermarket? This is your supermarket? Yes it is. Yes it is. Beautiful supermarket, too. There's no queues up here. Lex's favourite hunting spot may be an hour out of Te Anau, but it's smack bang in the path of John Beattie's proposed monorail project. If this thing goes through, this'll kill this particular valley. And this would have to be one of the nicest, um, places, probably, um, in the country. Right now, visitors have to skirt round the wilderness if they want to get from Queenstown to Milford. A South Island company, Riverstone Holdings, is proposing the monorail as a shortcut for tourists through southern conservation land. WOMAN: Come with us as we take a journey to the heart of Fiordland. It will allow us to carry, um, quite comfortably, up to half a million people a year. Even possibly as many as a million people a year. Riverstone Holdings director John Beattie has got big plans for Fiordland. And the Department of Conservation is considering his proposal. Rather than take them by coach, which is what happens at the moment and a 580km round trip, what we're proposing is boat across Lake Wakatipu and then a four-wheel drive vehicle through a valley on the other side of the lake to a point where, at a terminal, you would join a monorail trip and you would travel for 43km to Lake Te Anau. So the monorail would come down this forested valley, right at the foot of the mountain we're standing on. It travels around the base of the mountain, up through these trees, past this brown knob here in the foreground, and then away up into the forested valley over there. The price, according to objectors, tens of thousands of native trees. Lex is no greenie, he says, but to him these trees are priceless. How old do you think this forest is, then? How old do you think this forest is, then? Oh, older than God, I'd say. Yeah? Yeah? Yeah. It's around a long time. He must have been pretty busy. I don't think he made it on a Monday or a Tuesday. It would take him a bit longer than that. (LAUGHS) The developers concede they would have to cut down about 25,000 trees, half of them seedlings. If you try to do anything in Fiordland, you're going to be dealing with beech forest. What we're talking about with this is a proposition which involves taking one 50th of 1% of the beech forest in the Snowden Forest area. We're trying to avoid, basically, all significant trees along the route. We have the capability, because of the way the monorail can be designed to do that. Bullshit. Bullshit. < Really? Bullshit. < Really? (LAUGHS) Yeah. < Why? < Why? That's all it is. If I come up here and chop a tree down and took it home for firewood, DOC would chase me around with a big stick, and they'd probably take me to court. But these guys, they'd have to bulldoze and saw down thousands of trees to put their monorail in. It's just a crazy situation. It's totally unnecessary, and it's all being pushed ahead from a guy who doesn't even live down here. Where does he live? Where does he live? He lives in Wanaka. Where does he live? He lives in Wanaka. What's wrong with that? Oh, Wanaka's a nice place. It's a pity there wasn't some more nicer people there. Yeah, he doesn't, um, he doesn't need to do this. Interesting. Um, the directors of Riverstone are hunters and fishers. We've got a good general knowledge of the area. So we don't subscribe to his views. The monorail, he argues, would open the wilderness up for all to enjoy. Well, not everyone, says Lex. This monorail's gonna go through, and nobody will be allowed to shoot within, I think` it's half a kilometre of it, for a start. There will have to be safety arrangements established around the monorail, which means there'll be 'no shooting' signs. But we have no` by no means gone anywhere near the remote areas, which is where these hunters primarily have their greater success. Yet opponents claim the monorail threatens more than just hunting ` it threatens tourism itself. It's world heritage, and, you know, you just don't get world-heritage status lightly. You have to earn that. Southland district mayor Frana Cardno is a greenie from way back. ALL CHANT 40 years ago, she joined the Save Manapouri Campaign. The government plan ` raise the lake level for hydro-power. You know, we were told by the government of the day, by the local authority of the day, how good this was for the economy. It's history now. The project was scrapped after a massive uproar. And you think, 'That's it. We've saved these beautiful lakes, and people have learnt the lesson.' And then you see this happening and you say, 'Why? Why can't people realise that what we've got in our nature is something very special 'and we must preserve it?' What about the argument that that scenery could also generate a lot of money for the economy? It does now. It generates millions in its natural state. And I'll defy you to question any one of our visitors from Europe, from America, and you ask them what they like about our scenery. And they say it is unspoilt, untouched. Where else in the world can you find that? And, the objectors argue, monorail passengers would miss the drive from Te Anau to Milford, an attraction in itself. I've done it lots of times, both driving buses and in a private capacity, and it's just` it's just a beautiful` Hang on, I think I see a deer. < Where? < Where? I'm not sure if it's a deer or a bush. I can't quite pick it up. This is getting sidetracked. It's moved. It's gone. It's moved. It's gone. It's that easy, is it? Oh,... (LAUGHS) not always. Oh,... (LAUGHS) not always. No? Oh,... (LAUGHS) not always. No? No. But sometimes it can be. You just` You just never know. I'd say protect what we've got. It's really unique. Next up ` Glenorchy goes to war. A tiny town fights a multi-million-dollar mountain tunnel. We want economic growth, and we want all this lovely stuff, but we don't want to, sort of, enable it to happen in any way, it seems. SLOW GUITAR MUSIC Hidden at the head of Lake Wakatipu is Glenorchy, sentinel town on the edge of a wilderness. This is what people come here for ` to be surrounded by this beauty, to be surrounded by this untrashed, unpeopled, totally awesome sculpture. It's like living in a painting. But Sharon Aitken and her neighbours fear Glenorchy's splendid isolation is about to be shattered in the name of progress. For me, it's about saving this. It's our heritage. If we` If we turn this into a circus, what have we got left to give our kids? On the drawing board, an 11.3km tunnel through National Park mountains behind Glenorchy. Like the monorail to the south, the tunnel offers a shortcut from Queenstown to Milford Sound. Both proposals, by different developers, are being considered by DOC. Developer Tom Elworthy is pushing for the tunnel. It reduces the travel time from Queenstown to Milford by about 60%. So the whole project really is about time. Time is money. Time is money. But in a community that's worked the land for 150 years, they're asking, 'What's the hurry?' I think, you know, our future is, sort of, slow tourism, dare I say it, where people take their time, experience the place properly, meet the locals, yeah. Kate Scott and her mother Iris know the wilderness well. It's in their blood. We're a transition area from, you know, the more densely populated parts of the country into the wilderness. And that's what, I think, our community represents ` that, sort of, almost frontier kind of thing. But the tunnel would bring between 40 and 50 buses a day through Glenorchy and down this road. Most travellers that come here are independent travellers. They're not, you know, stacked up in a bus. Then there's the scale of the tunnel. Now, this would be the Glenorchy side of the tunnel, the beginning of a hole drilled through this rock 11.3km through solid rock behind me, an idea the locals say seemed so crazy and far-fetched, they didn't believe it at first. Now they're taking it very seriously indeed. On the other side, it opens out below the Routeburn Track, one of NZ's most celebrated wilderness walks. That brings people to Glenorchy daily to come in and just experience a little bit of the Routeburn. Not the place, Kate Scott argues, where trampers want a bus route. It's not a tranquil area. There's an airstrip there; there's Gunn's camp; there's buses already that run up and down there. There is so much river noise and noise of nature, if you like, there of wind and trees and things. Same thing. Noise analysis is, um, is negligible. So the sounds of the birds and the streams, they'll drown out the sounds of the buses. Is that what you're saying? Yeah, I guess so. It'll` The noise` the natural noise of the area will mean you won't hear the buses. Then there's the question of safety in a tunnel that's 11.3km long and only 5.5m wide. We've got the full safety plan. It's all there. We've got safety, um, vehicles at both ends, personnel, so, um, that's` we've considered that. Yes, but we're talking about a tunnel that's only just wide enough to open the doors of a bus. What if the way out is blocked by flames? Look, we don't` We haven't, um, seen any reason to think that that would happen. I mean, I suppose there's always the doomsday scenario where a bus just completely blows up, and that can happen on the road; it can happen anywhere. Yes, that will be unfortunate and would probably get quite warm, but there's risk in everything. But we believe that the safety of the individuals travelling through that tunnel will be at least as good, possibly better, because there's no oncoming traffic, frankly. Across the mountains in Te Anau, the very idea of a shortcut has already brought locals closer to Glenorchy in protest. The tunnel's even worse than the monorail. The monorail's bad enough. But that tunnel is just crazy situation. CHAINSAW REVS ALL CHANT: Save our park! Save our park! And it is not about greed and destruction. It is about preserving our future for NZers and our children. Since DOC is considering both proposals, conservation minister Kate Wilkinson is on the receiving end. Nice to meet you too. These are my grandchildren, Kate, and this is the valley we were talking about. And this is another granddaughter up there. And this is another granddaughter up there. Yep. It's Lex the hunter on a charm offensive. actually you've ruined my preconceived ideas about MPs. You're much cuter than any` You're much cuter than any` LAUGHTER ...other MP I have ever seen. I like this man. I like this man. LAUGHTER I like this man. LAUGHTER I'm Kate. Their beef, that the minister has announced the intention to grant concessions to both the tunnel and the monorail. Just a formality, she says. You have to indicate an intention, so that you can have the public consultation, and that's just the triggering mechanism, and this is what it's all about. And this is democracy. It's cool. And this is democracy. It's cool. Does that indication of intention indicate an approval? > No, absolutely not, and I think that's the confusion, cos it's absolutely not. It's the triggering mechanism to enable the public to be consulted. Do you accept that? > No I don't. Why would you say the intent to grant a concession if you weren't taking that seriously, when it is going against the National Park Management Plan? A point they made to the minister. The process should never have even started with these two projects < Hear, hear! < Hear, hear! if those documents had been used properly. Oh, well. It's going through its process. Oh, well. It's going through its process. CROWD: Hear, hear! Thank you, Minister. Thank you, Minister. No, thank you for that. And thank you` No, just thank you for your commitment to, you know, what really is a treasure out here. But down in Frana Cardno's basement lies an old warning for the government. These are from the Save Manapouri demonstrations 40 years ago this year. What happened last time? We won. We changed the government, and, um, you know, we are pretty serious this time. Leaving the battle lines for Fiordland drawn once more. We've got an extreme green element that's parachuted into this debate. They are not for progress. They are not for better wealth creation out of tourism opportunities. We don't have what some people have, is tunnel vision. we see a broader aspect, and we can see the commercial side of things in certain places, but in other places it's just not applicable at all. Spectacular pictures, weren't they? They were shot by Sunday cameraman Clint Bruce. Now a decision on these two proposals is expected later this year. Well, later on Sunday, NZ's ` perhaps Australasia's ` oldest dad. He's 79, has a wife 40 years his junior and young child and a baby. But next, dinky-di Aussie girls undercover. ROCK MUSIC CHEERING My name's Anisa. I'm fifth-generation Australian born. Are you a feminist? > Are you a feminist? > Yes, I am. You believe in women's rights? > You believe in women's rights? > Oh, yes. Definitely. Oh my God. At OPSM, we use precision technology for a 3-D view of the retina, helping us better detect eye disease such as macular degeneration. Just one of the ways we look deeper. Talk to OPSM about an eye-health check-up today. No other item of clothing has divided public opinion quite like the burka. We've heard plenty from those who believe the burka has no place here, but we've heard nothing from those behind the veil, especially those who have converted. Until now, that is. Here's Rani Sadler. I just felt like I know where I'm going in my life, what I'm here for, what I should be striving for, and everything just fell into place. (LAUGHS) I'd love to go skydiving one day. (LAUGHS) It's a leap of faith to cover yourself from the world and drop out of sight especially if... 'Man, you're a dinky-di Aussie!' Whoo-hoo! Whoo! How does wearing the burka make you feel? How does wearing the burka make you feel? I can't imagine life without it. Um, if I was forced to take it off, I would stay at home and never leave. I love it. I really can't imagine life without it. The message is that a good woman is a woman I can't see, and, for me, that is a very dangerous message. My name's Anisa. I'm a fifth-generation Australian-born. Are you a feminist? > Are you a feminist? > Yes, I am. You believe in women's rights? > You believe in women's rights? > Oh, yes. Definitely. Oh my God! Match shot. On a quiet stretch of water on the outskirts of Sydney are two Australias, uncovered and covered. In the boat behind her is Anisa's husband. When she's at home with him and their kids, Anisa doesn't cover up. But to the outside world, she only reveals her hands and eyes. I feel liberated, and I'm not saying being covered is being liberated, but that's how I feel. Explain that to me. How are you more liberated than I am? When I'm interacting, say, with men, outside in society, when I'm out shopping, I know there's no, sort of, that physical or sexual attraction there. From a Pakistani background, Anisa is a fifth-generation Australian. Growing up, her family didn't believe in face coverings. The turning point was 9/11. Anisa faced hostility for being a Muslim, but rather than turn her back on her religion, she embraced it. I studied the life of the Prophet, and when you study the life of someone, or you fall in love with someone, it's like a hero. You want to duplicate what they did or what they had in their life. It's like people who love, I don't know, Justin Bieber. The boys are out there to copy Justin Bieber. But for us it was to duplicate the life of the prophet Muhammad. What do you think the benefits are for you every day wearing it? Um, the benefits? I'm in an act of worship every time I wear it. I'm pleasing my Lord every time I wear it. I am copycatting the wives of the Prophet and the female companions in the time of the Prophet who wore it. They're the benefits, um... Yeah, that's basically it. Born in Iraq, Amina came to Australia as a kid. Married to Ahmed, they have a young son and another baby on the way. They're like any other couple arguing over what to watch. Normally, Amina wouldn't cover herself in her home, but tonight she's wearing the burka because our camera crew is all male. In Amina's case, the eyes haven't always had it. Because you started with the hijab. Because you started with the hijab. Mm-hm. Because you started with the hijab. Mm-hm. And what's the hijab? The hijab is where your face and your hands show, but everything else is covered. Right. And the niqab is where your face is covered but your eyes are showing, sometimes your hands as well. The burka is when you're completely covered, which is what I'm wearing now, is the burka. And what are the rules with the burka? You have the gloves as well? The rules are the clothing has to be baggy, nothing tight-fitting, nothing attractive. So no colourful, light, pale, no glitter, nothing like that. Dull colours. Um, no perfume. They're basically the rules. Gloves, yeah, socks. So you wouldn't be wearing this? So you wouldn't be wearing this? (CHUCKLES) No, not with the burka. As her faith grew more conservative, she dropped out of uni and now won't leave home without her husband. She says he'd divorce her if she didn't wear the burka, and she'd divorce him if he insisted she take it off. Her choice to wear the burka means she's often yelled at by those who disagree, like this day. Oh, shut up. Oh, shut up, you idiot. God. That wasn't good. That wasn't good. God. That wasn't good. That wasn't good. That was on camera. Look at her. Look at her. Yeah, let her. Look at her. Yeah, let her. Don't worry about it. They are probably on heroin or something. Leave her, man. She's off her head. 'It made me feel very upset. Like, this is the 21st century. We're in Australia. 'Like, everybody's able to do what they do and wear what they wear, so why are you now attacking me?' I pay my taxes. I work. I study. Why do I not have the same freedom as everybody else to do as I please? A bit of, uh... A bit of action, you know what I mean? I look after a baby. I have a husband. I have a home. I have a family. Same old person, same as everybody else. Only difference is, I believe in... I believe in the one Lord, Allah, the creator of all. (WOMAN PRAYS) Does it make you sad to see women dressed the way I am? Um, it does make me sad because I believe that I am in the right. For you, this is probably oppression, but, for me, it's guidance. For me, it's freedom. For me, it's everything. For me, it's freedom. For me, it's everything. To me, it seems like oppression, so how do you explain to me why I would benefit from wearing that? If I'm oppressed, I will say I'm oppressed. But I'm not oppressed. I do it out of choice. I do it because I believe in it. I do it because I love it. Is it a bit hotter under there? Is it a bit hotter under there? (LAUGHS) No! When it's hot, we're all hot, and at the end of the day, I believe that the fire of hell is hotter. I will be roasted in hell if I go out with my skin and my hair showing. So the fire of hell is hotter. I'd rather cop the heat of this world rather than the heat of the hereafter. Well, when we come back ` something recognised in Islam as adultery of the eyes. A man checking out a woman, looking her over, and the notion that men simply can't control themselves. That's the thing. That is a notion that is insulting to men and women, you know, my brother and my father and these wonderful Muslim men I know. It is deeply insulting and offensive to them to think that just seeing my hair, just seeing my face, just seeing anything is just gonna turn them into these animals, worse than animals. So, the rules of the burka are, according to the young woman in our story ` it has to be baggy, unattractive and dull; you should wear gloves and socks and no perfume. All designed to foil what's known as 'adultery of the eyes', stopping men from looking a woman over; checking her out. However, there are some Muslim women who find that notion unfathomable and objectionable. Rani Sadler again. There is nothing in the Koran that says a woman should cover her face. Nothing. It's an interpretation. By who? By men. Mona Eltahawy is a world-renowned Muslim writer. I wore the headscarf for nine years. I chose to wear it, and I chose to take it off. I chose to take it off because I realised it wasn't the only way to be a Muslim woman. And my identity is in my face. And so, behind a niqab, you don't know who I am. I am just this entity, moving, and that really scares me. But just as importantly, you don't see my expressions ` you don't see I'm happy or sad. Universally, our facial expressions are recognised, regardless of language, which says to me the human face is really important. Ladies, when you do it, please do it with nice, gentle strokes because you want your hostess to feel pampered, be relaxed. For Anisa, the face is especially important. It's her day job selling beauty products. You get 20% off the pure essential oils. > At face value, it seems an unlikely career, but Anisa sees it differently. I'll show you how it makes her eyes look bigger. She says while there's nothing wrong with being beautiful, it becomes wrong when it's all women are judged on. There is, being in the beauty industry, and meeting so many different women, there is so much pressure on women in society, with Botox and liposuction, and their appearance all the time, for society to accept them. And I don't believe a woman's body or a woman's charms should be used for her to gain acceptance and recognition in society. Why shouldn't men have to cover up? Why shouldn't men have to cover up? Because women don't have to cover either, it's just a personal choice. But why shouldn't it be the same for both? Why shouldn't both men and women...? Because God has created men and women differently. 'I like the fact that I can walk throughout society without men looking at me.' Cheese and spinach. 'And it gives me control over who I show my beauty to and who I don't.' I like the fact that I am free from the slavery of having to follow trends and fashions and what society's perceptions of how a woman should look like. I'm freed from all of that. Behind this veil is the face of a seventh-generation Australian. Mouna is a convert to Islam. She grew up in the suburbs in a Christian family. I was brought up in a strong Christian household. I used to attend Sunday school and church on a regular basis. (PRAYS) When Mouna was a teenager, she picked up the Koran at a friend's house and it changed the course of her life. She's married to Tarek. They have five children. Who can see your face and who can't? Basically, you show your face to any lady and any close male relative. It's only men who you could marry, you know. They're the ones you cover your face from. Islam recognises that there is something called adultery of the eye where a man checks out a woman, looks her over, checks out her features of her body. So that's why you find in Islam, it forbids everything that leads towards adultery and fornication. What about the notion that men can't control themselves, so women are, in fact, safer underneath the niqab? Well, that is a notion that is insulting to men and women. You know, my brother and my father and all these wonderful Muslim men I know, it is deeply insulting and offensive to them to think that just seeing my hair, just seeing my face, just seeing anything, is going to turn them into these animals. My favourite argument against niqab is that the men should wear blindfolds rather than women having their faces covered. If we are doing it for men because they can't control themselves, then I want the men to go out there and not see anything rather than me not be seen. On the issue of seeing, Mona has another, more practical objection. I know that there are several countries, including Muslim-majority countries, like Kuwait, for example, that ban women who wear the niqab from driving, for the very simple reason that you do not have peripheral vision, and I want people on the road in cars to have peripheral vision. (LAUGHS) But out on the road with Mouna, it was not so much peripheral vision that was of concern,... CAR ENGINE REVS ...but a local hoon who tried to take her on. The rev-head got as good as he gave. (LAUGHS) Not only do we not see these women, but we rarely hear from them. Come on. This is a strike. ALL CHEER Devout, even defiant, their views are deeply held, and for that they offer no apology to those who dislike them. There was one lady, she was funny, but she was a new migrant to Australia, and she said, 'Oh...' She walked up to me, and she goes, 'You know, you look so ugly in that.' And you know the funny thing is I feel like saying to them, 'If you don't like Australia for how it is, maybe you should go back to where you came from.' (LAUGHS) OK. What draws a 19-year-old woman to a 60-year-old man? When he gets out of the shower, when he` when he comes to bed, what do you see? I see a great guy. I mean, he's always got a smile on his face. And, well, I think he's got a great arse. ENGINE RATTLES SONIC CRACKLING, ZAPPING Debt comes in all shapes and sizes. SONIC CRACKLING, ZAPPING Sometimes borrowing is a smart thing to do,... SONIC ZAPPING INTENSIFIES ...and sometimes it isn't. SONIC ZAPPING SOARS Shrink your dumb debt. It's all part of being sorted. Harvey Keitel did it when he was 65, Rod Stewart when he was 66 and Pablo Picasso 67. These days a lot of men are doing it later ` having babies. 50 is the new 30; 60 the new 40. Auckland cartoonist Peter Bromhead broke local records, plunging back into the world of nappies aged 78. Yep, 78. So how old is too old to become an older father? (HUMS) I have a delivery. Two children, two deliveries. All yours. (LAUGHS) No, it's not granddad dropping off the kids. What have you got, darling? (GASPS) Look at that. This is a nuclear family. (COOS) Most people think I'm his daughter if they don't know. And I say, 'Oh, mean my husband.' Yeah. Hello. A lot of guys who've talked to him, they say` who are in their 40s, 50s, they say, 'Oh, well you give me hope.' (COOS) They always congratulate me and shake my hands and think it's impressive. But women of a certain age always turn round and say, 'That'll teach you.' (LAUGHS) For marrying a younger woman. Carolyn was 19 when they met ` a science undergrad working part-time at the ASB Tennis Centre. Peter ` getting tennis lessons, aged 60. 19-year-old woman` 19-year-old woman` Yes. 60-year-old man. 60-year-old man. Yes. Some people's reaction is going to be, 'Yuck.' And a lot of people did. It was a laugh at the beginning, really. But you became physically attracted to him? But you became physically attracted to him? Yes. Very much so? > Very much so? > Very much so. He's charming; he's very polite. And he` you know, he's` he's a very loving person. Like, when he gets out of the shower, when he comes to bed, what do you see? I see a great guy. I mean, he's always got a smile on his face. I think` Well, I think he's got a great arse. How many guys had you dated before Peter? Seriously? None. I'm just very lucky to have found my soulmate so young. Whatever the paradox of the age difference and all the rest of it, we got on well; we understood each other very well. (HUMS) He told me straight-up, 'Look, I'm not planning to get married again. I don't want any more children.' You know, and that` 'Take it or leave it.' I said that? < Yes. < Yes. Well, what would you say if you'd just come out of a very expensive divorce? They kept the relationship secret. I kept it from my parents. I kept it from my parents. And you kept it from your friends? I kept it from my parents. And you kept it from your friends? And my sisters, yes. Everybody. You're starting to run on to what I call, um, into shallow water, when your prospective father-in-law and mother-in-law are younger than yourself. I thought they would try and stop me seeing him. After five years, they got married quietly in Hawaii. And your parents didn't know? And your parents didn't know? Still didn't know. And your parents didn't know? Still didn't know. (LAUGHS) You are a naughty girl. I know. She rang and told her parents two days into the marriage. And Carolyn was thinking,... 'He's married me now. That was one of the first things he said he wasn't ever gonna do again. 'Maybe, when the timing's right, you know, we might have children.' And after a number of miscarriages, they did. Oscar, who's 7, born when Peter was 72. Peter already has a clutch of grown-up children. They're now in their 20s, 30s and 50s. Are you grateful for this chance to do it again? You know, I don't sit around thinking, 'I am grateful,' obviously, but, um, it's` it's a time of great happiness for me. OK, Oscar, go under the water, and don't do a bellyflop. Ah! Oscar wasn't his last bit of happiness. Splash! Just last year... I walked into the chemist shop down below here, and I said, 'I want a pregnancy testing kit.' And they said, 'Oh, is this for your daughter?' And he's, like, 'No, it's for me. 'And can I have a cyanide tablet at the same time?' (LAUGHS) So, yes. So then it obviously was positive. And baby Felix joined brother Oscar. (SQUEALS) Whoa, that's cool. While contemporaries push around golf trundlers, Peter heads to a regular playground, joking about it in his own cartoons. Yes, yes, you're going up high. You are. I don't feel any sense of old age. In fact, I'm not sure how one copes with old age. I see it around me, but I am not sure what I'm supposed to do about it. Makes no difference to Felix, and at this stage, Oscar's oblivious. The only time he's ever said that he thought he had an old dad was when he'd hurt his knee and Peter suddenly had to get a walking stick out to help him with his knee. And Oscar said, 'Dad, why have you turned into an old man? Look, I'm still working full-time by choice, you know. I like my life. I enjoy my life, and, um, you know, I sort of still feel I'm burning like white fire inside. So do you fear death? So do you fear death? No. No, I certainly don't. As well as the Bromheads' booming interior-design business where Carolyn works, Peter's still cartooning daily. This is my new book that I've written. And he writes children's books. READS: If you notice it's got a distinctive strawberry-looking bottom... CHILDREN LAUGH He's reading his latest to his son Oscar's class. READS: ...thumping against the window and thought they might be something bigger or nastier... 'Young children grow up with the speed of light. 'You miss out on a lot of pleasure and delight in those early years if you don't pay attention to it.' I actually have apologised to my grown-up sons that I didn't spend more time with them. It'd be better if we didn't have birthdays. Then we'd never get older, would we? I've got one tomorrow. (LAUGHS) I'm starting to feel it. I've got one tomorrow. (LAUGHS) I'm starting to feel it. How old are you turning? How old am I turning? How old am I turning? Yeah. How old am I turning? Yeah. 79. CHILDREN: Whoa! CHILDREN: Whoa! Wow. That` CHILDREN: Whoa! Wow. That` You're bigger than my nana. ...That's a big number, isn't it? ...That's a big number, isn't it? I know, Dad, but I can't wait for your birthday. (LAUGHS) Yes. How did you cope with the physicality of being an older dad? I was awake at 3 o'clock this morning for a couple of hours, uh, with baby kicking around and all the rest of it, and holding him and helping putting him to sleep. I don't seem to be suffering too much at this stage, do I? (HUMS) Older dads ` technically, that's men over 40 ` do have a greater risk of having children with dwarfism, autism and schizophrenia. I think there's been probably a misconception that, you know, women, in terms of their eggs, certainly age, but blokes are absolutely fine. And I think we now know that that's not the case. Hopefully my children won't have those problems. They're, you know` Oscar's already been marked up as a special case in that he's a gifted child, they say. He's 79 tomorrow! Dad, I can't wait for your birthday. And that's when we get the balloons on. The shrinks all came to the conclusion that he was happy and well-adjusted and just needed some special attention. Dr Gudex says there's another obvious consideration with much older dads. So, the average age for a man to live in NZ is 80ish. Obviously depends on a lot of factors, including any other significant health issues. But, you know, if you're having a child in your mid to late 60s, you need to think around the fact that, you know, am I gonna be around when this child's a teenager? You'll be 100 by the time that Felix, your baby, is 21. Born '33; year Hitler came to power. That really makes me feel ancient. Are you confident you're going to be around for that? Are you confident you're going to be around for that? I have no idea. My father died in, what, 1940. I was 6, I think. ALL: # Happy birthday, dear Oscar... This year, Oscar has seven candles in his cake. # ...to you. # < Hip hoorah! 'Children are tough, you know. I survived when I was 6, because you have to.' There will be people who wag the finger and say I shouldn't be having children at my age; that it's wrong because of the, uh, limited lifespan that I may subject them to. How do you answer those sort of people? How do you answer those sort of people? 'Get stuffed.' I can get it out. How often do you have babies coming to dinner? Happy birthday, darling. Happy birthday, darling. Thank you. Happy birthday. Happy birthday. Say, 'Happy birthday, Daddy.' Happy birthday. Say, 'Happy birthday, Daddy.' < Happy birthday. Thank you. Thank you. Cheers. > 'You know, life is so precious. Absolutely. Yeah.' How about that, eh? Mwah. 'I think they're very lucky to have him as a father.' A father with 79 candles. OK, you're gonna have to help, Oscar. One, two, three... > (BLOWS) (BLOWS) Whoa! (BLOWS) Whoa! Keep going. Blow! > Don't turn round and say to me, 'Oh, are you planning to have any more children?' Because obviously we're not. < Could happen. < Could happen. Possibly. Who knows. We're not, obviously, at this stage, planning any more children, so` But that's not to say that we're not gonna stop having sex. (LAUGHS) Would you like us to give another one? There you are. Mwah. There we are. And a word of thanks to Marti Friedlander ` Oscar's godmother ` for her photo of Carolyn and Felix from the boys' christening. On Sunday next week, a debate about what we are doing to our planet and the Antarctic. A Kiwi movie looks at one of the last places on earth where the ecosystem is perfectly in tune ` the stunning Ross Sea. R-O-S-S? Ross Sea? No, I've never heard of it. Is it the east side, west side of New York city? As you're moving down towards the Ross Sea, it gets richer and richer, and you have this sense of it growing, and you're about to witness a true concert of life. So, here I was on a cliff above the Ross Sea at Cape Crozier on Ross Island. Along comes this blue fishing vessel and begins to deploy a longline. I mean, the idea that there'd be commercial fishing in the Ross Sea would` I would not have believed it. DRAMATIC CHORD I always think of NZ as an eco-friendly country. The toothfish produced a goldrush mentality. The hours of the market is 1 in the morning to 9 in the morning. Those are the market hours. These are our 6kg to 8 kilo fin. This is probably the most popular size. There's no socially redeeming value about taking a toothfish out and serving it up on a platter to people in the most expensive restaurants in North America. < Have you heard of Chilean sea bass? < Have you heard of Chilean sea bass? I have, yes. They're sending it here? And we're eating it? DRAMATIC MUSIC The true cost for ordering toothfish in a New York restaurant is that essentially you're destroying an eco-system. We have a chance to protect it... or to lose it forever. Yeah, it's a worry. Uh, NZ led the charge to exploit the fishery, but have we got it right? Would you eat toothfish? Should we leave this part of the planet alone? That's next week, and that's our show for tonight. Do check us out on Facebook ` 'Sunday TVNZ'. Thanks for joining us. Nga mihi nui. Hei kona.